Sissies

[likes2blocked]

I do have loads of cleaning to do and if all I had to do was to beat my cleaner once a day in exchange for getting it done, I can't imagine I'd have a problem if it was some hairy arsed bloke dressed like a French maid.

ROTFLMAO. I have to pay ours... I suspect ours needs less direct supervision!

Now, push that out a little more until the separation between a man and his sexuality develops into a form of misandry - a hatred and resentment of that control. It then extends not just to the immediately obvious sexual organs but to everything male - the clothes, the beard growth, the flat male chest. The obsessive interest in silky knickers and other stereotypical symbols of the feminine makes sense when a man is trying to escape everything that shows that he is male. Push that out a tad further and you get a community that is discussing some pretty extreme stuff such as hormone control and enforced impotence.

I'd tend to agree with Jimi here. People have different brain development based on events early in development and hormones, but it is a spectrum. Someone toward the middle, or even the opposite side of where they'd expect to be from their physical gender can get to be distressed, and not all of them go to the lengths of surgery.

I don't know that they're the far end of the chastity continuum. I think there's roughly 3 groups -

People who are just into chastity for its own sake, which seems to be the sort of people who hang out here.

People who use chasity as one aspect of an overall D&S lifestyle.

People who use chastity as an aspect of a feminization fetish.

There's clearly overlap between all of these - we're primarily in the first group, but dabble in the 2nd.

[Sarah]

I still hold with my theory that at least some "sissies" are simply transexual folk who are not comfortable enough to go forward with doctors, therapists, hormone therapy, surgery etc.

Your theory is actually a hypothesis, Jimi...

x

Sarah

[Mayhew]

So here's my first starter for ten. I think the over representation of sissies is due to the fact that there is an externally obvious facet to being a member of this particular community....The more vanilla chastity community is somewhat quieter and less represented simply because most people just get on with it without the need for a support mechanism.

Nice post.

The internet is pretty crazy generally, for molding perceptions of "what your kink is" into groups, based on identifiers such as cross dressing. A lot of guys probably get into the sissy thing precisely because they move along that continuum you mention, without having the self-awareness to get off it, or slow themselves down. They do end drinking the rot gut, when all they wanted was the glass of wine, because it seems like everyone else is doing it. Just a theory. (And I have never read Chastity Mansion so I can't really judge.)

My other comment was about the sexual negation thing. There is a big difference between someone who wants to amplify their own sexual feelings through sublimation, and someone who wants to negate their sexuality because they feel that it is wrong for them, or that they do not deserve pleasure.

I'm still basically into pleasure - male pleasure. I have just learned that for me, there's actually more of it to be had through sublimation and denial than there is through regular orgasm. Chastity feels great.

So, maybe, I'm less tempted by the sissification route than someone who might feel that they weren't male, or, that they did not deserve pleasure in some way.

On a tangent:

I have sometimes thought about what kind of submissive woman I would want if were a dominant.

I wouldn't really want a woman with low self esteem who wanted to be treated badly because she felt she deserved it. In fact that would be pretty gross.

I would actually want someone with a very high self-regard, who had realized that there was great joy to be had in submission. Not someone who wanted to nullify themselves, but someone who wanted to amplify their own experience and try to gain freedom through relinquishing personal control.

I could go for that.

[davidphd1866]

ssshhh, Mayhew, don't tell the keyholders that you actually get more pleasure out of denial......it will blow our cover and this whole chastity thing will lose its edge.......

[Tom Allen]

I'm going to disagree with the continuum model, based on nothing but my own ruminations about sexuality over the years.

I used to think that pretty much all sexuality was a continuum, but what we don't realize is that a continuum is often a way to model or explain behavior on a two dimensional scale. For example, I once thought it would be quite natural for people to progress from straight "vanilla" sex, into oral, perhaps anal sex, and from there into light bondage, and then on to sensation play. When I actually started dating around (and talking to friends that were doing likewise) I was often amazed at how so many people considered themselves to be "kinky", yet never "progressed" beyond certain ranges.

Eventually I began to see sexuality not as a line, but more like a large house party. Most of the people are in the living room, but you'll find a few people who wander into the kitchen, hang out for a while, then move onto the patio, decide they don't like the cool air, then move to the garage, or perhaps wander into one of the spare bedrooms. A few other people will end up in the basement den and stay there most of the evening, and a couple of people will end up playing with the dog all night.

This isn't a continuum, but rather, a more open model that, I think, reflects how many people approach sexuality - as an opportunity to try different things.

[likes2blocked]

I used to think that pretty much all sexuality was a continuum, but what we don't realize is that a continuum is often a way to model or explain behavior on a two dimensional scale.

Actually, two dimensions is only the start of it. Robert Anton Wilson came up with a really interesting model of human behavior in "Prometheus Rising" that actually went to 8 dimensions. The first and most basic was towards pleasure/food and away from pain/badness. The second was on a territorial basis, which is about where a dog operates. It is interesting to note how many people aren't any more sophisticated than dogs. It is similar to Leary's 8 Circuit model of consciousness. By the time you get to the 4th level, you're working with social consciousness, or lack thereof. The higher levels start getting very weird - Leary's 8th circuit, the psycho-atomic was reached with large doses of acid (go figure, it was Leary...). Wilson's 8th level wasn't related to drugs, but more along the lines of metaphysics.

Eventually I began to see sexuality not as a line, but more like a large house party.

Probably a better metaphor, but if you instead look at it as multiple continuums - for example, dom-sub, adventurous or not, straight-bi-gay, sissy-middle of the road - butch, then it starts to handle more complex sets of behaviors.

[Mayhew]

I think the continuum model is still useful, not for a description of the way people's sexuality actually works, but the way it can get played out in social settings.

So basically I agree with Tom - people will do what they want to do, look in different rooms, try different things, but ultimately, sex that doesn't feel right won't last the distance. Much easier if you in a relationship to try things out, obviously.

But in the meantime, I do think there are a lot of folks who enter into femdom or other kinks as a set and recognised practice, based on all the advice literature available in many competing blogs and texts. And no matter how many disclaimers an individual "authority" has about how "each person has to find what is right for them", there's going to be folks who try to "progress" in a pre-set direction that has been handed down to them by those authorities.

My guess is that this is particularly the case for folks who have a kink but no partner to keep them grounded.

This is a live issue for me because I sense that without my own partner to keep me grounded, I might well have been the sort of person whose perceptions of my own kink were swayed by the dominant culture. Something of a bee in my bonnet lately.

[WendyWicke]

I think there are so many sissy maids visible on formums because they like to be visible on forums.

They are exhibitionists - that's a big part of their kink. I assume that not all cross-dressers are exhibitionists, and that many men go around wearing women's panties under their Brooks Brother's suits and it gives them a thirll. But some cross-dressers are exhibitionists and the thrill they get isn't just wearing women's clothes but being seen wearing them.

So they're drawn to forums where they are extremely visible and LOUD. LOOK AT ME!!!! LOOK AT ME!

That's what turns them on.

I totally understand them in that sense. I am or used to be an exhibitionist myself. Thinking of some of the things I did, I'm a little embarrassed but also still turned on thinking about them.

Where was I going with all this? Oh, righto - I don't think sissy maids really make up that big a percentage of the chasity croud, I just think they're a really vocal, visible, attention seeking part of it so it seems like there are more of them.

[Celtic Queen]

Fantastic debate guys and lively clear points. Fun this, isn't it!!!

Wait til I chuck one out there on pain and humiliation...

[Shane67]

My guess is that this is particularly the case for folks who have a kink but no partner to keep them grounded.

My problem with this line of argument is that it implies that "sissies" are engaging in an unhealthy kink. They are not. You could make the same argument about male chastity: that it's for folks who have a kink but no partner to keep them grounded. Trying to be objective about it: what's more extreme? A guy who occasionally dresses up to dust his furniture, or the one who punches a rather large hole through his dick for the main purpose of securing a hunk of stainless steel to it for months on end? I sometimes think we're blinded by the eloquence, thoughtfulness, and sheer volume of Thumper's blog: if someone writes so seductively about the subject it must be an OK kink. Perhaps the sissy world is waiting for its own bunny...

Also, as I guy who appreciates a lot kinks, and who seems to be appreciating more and more as the years go by, I never know what I might find hot. Personally, visual depiction of sissies don't do much for me, but certain genres of over-the-top sissy fiction can be extremely hot.

... I don't think sissy maids really make up that big a percentage of the chastity crowd, I just think they're a really vocal, visible, attention seeking part of it so it seems like there are more of them.

As a lurker on CM and CLS, I have to agree. Plus forums reflect the interests of the moderators, so it's no surprise sissies frequent those forums.